(urth) Hunter of the East

[Gerry Quinn]

From: James Wynn 
On 11/13/2011 7:40 AM, Gerry Quinn wrote: 
  From: James Wynn 



    > > Gerry Quinn wrote:

    > > Answered in my previous post.  
    > > The rising Sun *is* in a real sense visible in the poem.  Unlike Orion.
  > > Just to clarify our terms. "In a real sense" means "not". 

  > So you don’t agree that it’s possible to see something in a mirror, or in general by its reflection? 


> The sky is not a reflection. You are imagining a mirror, and a refection, all your own.
>  You are creating your own poem here. 

The ‘noose of light’ around the turret is reflected sunlight.  It’s not exactly a conventional mirror, but when you see it you *are* seeing the Sun.  


  > > > Are you saying that because the Iliad speaks of the Dawn's "rosy fingers"? Now
  > > >  you are using knowledge of classical literature to buttress your interpretation. 

  > > Yes, because the well-known association is there, unlike the case in the poem
  > >  where were are talking about a noose.  The noose is apparently a new 
  > > metaphor dreamt up by  Fitzgerald; it has no classical associations that I know of.

  > > > But that is totally legitimate because YOU are doing it. I don't recall anywhere 
  > > > that the sun is associate with nooses, ropes, or lariats. (Sun as cowboy?)

  > > It’s not – I interpret the poem on its own terms.  If the poem had referred to the 
  > > Huntsman’s starry sword, I’d have no hesitation in saying the Huntsman is Orion.
  > >   But he’s the Huntsman of the East, and he throws a noose of sunlight, so he’s 
  > > obviously the rising Sun.
> o...m...g.
> 
> So, for literature written at any time in history, it is a legitimate classical reference
>  if Gerry knows about it. Gerry already knows every classical reference that matters.
>  The ones he knows are overridingly important. The ones he doesn't know, he's not 
> going to learn because that would be pointless. AND it is a legitimate reference if 
> it suddenly occurs to Gerry at the time. All other references "lesser-legitimate". 
> Cool. Glad we've nailed that down at last.

That’s all nonsense and you know it.  I am sure I am not as au fait with classical references as some, but I am perfectly well aware of the references to Orion as huntsman, and Dawn’s rosy fingers.  It doesn’t mean I draw up some mindless program where any reference to a hunter must needs involve Orion, or whatever.  What bit of the word *interpretation* do you not understand?

I’m not saying Orion isn’t there because I didn’t ever hear of Orion the hunter, or because I didn’t think of it first.  I’m saying Orion isn’t there because the Sun as Hunter metaphor works given the imagery in the poem, and because there is no Orion imagery there that works.

- Gerry Quinn



-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.urth.net/pipermail/urth-urth.net/attachments/20111113/f91ea8cc/attachment-0004.htm>