(urth) Indescribable Christ?

Bob Miller bob_bageera at hotmail.com
Sat Feb 7 04:33:24 PST 2009

Matt, I admire the elegance of your phraseology.  Thank you.
> Christology as a focus of controversy has cooled a great deal since the 5th century, but most Christian bodies consider it an essential part of the faith; the catechisms of the largest Christian churches all address it.  Clearly, quite a few people consider it important.
> Simple arithmetic suffices for most of my mathematical needs.  I find complex geometry obscure, but that's not justification for me to conclude that it's useless.  Math, like religion, is bigger than my experience and my special feelings.
> -- 
> Matt +
> To which I must reply, "Well said".
> ~have a nice weekend y'all.
> ~Witz
> >-----Original Message-----
> >From: Roy C. Lackey [mailto:rclackey at stic.net]
> >Sent: Friday, February 6, 2009 03:35 PM
> >To: 'The Urth Mailing List'
> >Subject: Re: (urth) Indescribable Christ?
> >
> >"Son of Witz" wrote:
> >>>> I completely agree.  I've understood it as GOD, the Godhead, is
> >indescribable, but that inaccessibility is the main reason for Jesus to be.
> >To give us a path.  This is where the Logos comes in as that which
> >reconciles God and Man. What's Jesus say about finding the Father only
> >through me, or such. The Logos is the bridge. And we've been comparing texts
> >and exegesis about to characters that may or may not be incarnations of the
> >Logos.<<<
> >--------------------------
> >
> >This subject is tiresome and has been done to death over the years, and
> >leads nowhere. People are talking past each other, as ever. I should stay
> >out of it. But I will make an appeal to the text.
> >
> >At issue here is whether or not Severian is in any meaningful sense a
> >manifestation of the Christ, rather than someone who merely has Christ-like,
> >or Christic (as I believe someone here once termed it) qualities. The
> >difference is unimportant to some, but to Christians (which I am not) it is
> >paramount.
> >
> >In the Christian mythos, the life, death and resurrection of Jesus was, and
> >ever will be, a *unique* event. As such, it can never be replicated--to do
> >so would cheapen the magnitude of the supreme sacrifice. This distinguishes
> >Jesus from the many cyclical dying-and-resurrecting gods we are familiar
> >with.
> >
> >While it is true that there are correspondences between the lives of Jesus
> >and Severian, it is equally true that Severian manifests the qualities of
> >a -- well, duh! -- generic sun god, but that doesn't make him Mithra, or any
> >of the others.
> >
> >As for Severian the Conciliator being the same as Jesus, the "bridge" that
> >reconciles Man and God, he is *not*. He is a conciliator between Man and the
> >Hierogrammates, as the text makes clear.
> >
> >Shortly after his being returned to Urth in Typhon's era, the villagers
> >complained to Severian about the cold weather (occasioned by the sun's
> >recent decline) that had ruined their crops in recent years, saying "The sky
> >people are angry with us." He explained:
> >_________________
> >"The sky people-the Hierodules and Hierarchs-do not hate us. It is only that
> >they are remote from us, and they fear us because of things we did before,
> >long ago when our race was young. I have gone to them." I watched the
> >villagers' expressionless faces, wondering whether any of them would believe
> >me. "I have effected a conciliation-brought them nearer us and us nearer
> >them, I think. They've sent me back." (URTH, chap. XXIX, p.-204)
> >__________________
> >
> >It can be argued -- and it has been -- whether or not the Hierogrammates
> >were acting on orders from On High, or even that they only *believed* they
> >were doing God's will, willingly or unwillingly, but the textual fact of the
> >matter is that Severian, the Conciliator, was a bridge between Man and the
> >Hierogrammates, not Man and God.
> >
> >-Roy
> >
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