(urth) What's So Great About Ushas

[Paul B]

No, you misunderstand what I meant by invoking Baldanders, a scientist on a
planet without scientists.  He _knows_ more than other Urthlings, and can
make better guesses than them on a variety of subjects.  He "perceives more
of the universe".

Any society is comprised of individuals on a continuum of cognitive
ability.  To let this govern morality is unfair at best, and horrifying at
worst.
This is why letting the Hierogrammates off simply on the basis of their
superior understanding is an abhorrent idea.

Paul

On Tue, Jul 15, 2008 at 4:37 AM, O'Donnell, Tim (BOSI) <
Tim.O'Donnell at bankofscotland.ie <Tim.O%27Donnell at bankofscotland.ie>> wrote:

>  Hi Paul,
>
> The point that I took from this discussion, and I think it is valid, is
> that the Hieros have the ability to perceive more of
>
> the universe than humans; they experience time differently.  So when
> someone talks about knowledge, I take it to refer to this aspect of their
>
> knowing and not their ability to produce technology, etc. (which is where
> the similarity with Baldanders comes in).
>
> So, while the Hieros are still making guesses on the outcome of their
> actions (who isn't [apart from God] in a quantum universe?) they do have the
>
>
> advantage of having more knowledge of the outcome of events.  And so, their
> moral code differs from the humans who are bound to A->B linear time.
>
> This seems a reasonable argument to me.
>
> Tim
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________________
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________________
>
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 13:17:23 -0400
> From: "Paul B" <pb.stuff at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: (urth) What's So Great About Ushas
> To: "The Urth Mailing List" <urth at lists.urth.net>
> Message-ID:
>         <3e1fa2e90807141017o3d51d1f2o5822ad1ba5d40de2 at mail.gmail.com>
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>
> I see we haven't moved much farther.
>
> Firstly, I would suggest that you stop calling the Hierogrammates "angels".
> They are created by humans (Hieros), and you have yet to provide convincing
> evidence of their ties to anything godly.   Superior knowledge alone is
> certainly no such evidence (see Baldanders).
>
> Secondly, denying their godliness doesn't make one a "secular humanist".
> It
> makes one a skeptical reader who doesn't add what he pleases to the text.
>
> Finally, you seem to insist that knowledge and morality are proportional.
> God knows all, the Hierogrammates know less, the average Urthlings don't
> know very much, and an arctother knows even less than that.  This you
> insist
> makes the Urthlings unable to morally judge the Hierogrammates, just as the
> arctother can't judge the Urthlings.
>
> Even the Hierogrammates, however, are still making probabilistic guesses,
> as
> Roy's UotNS quote proves handily.  Your system of "morality" thus suggests
> that whoever can make the most informed guess in a closed system is the
> moral superior and not to be challenged.
>
> Now again consider Baldanders, likely the most knowledgeable, and
> incidentally one of the more immoral, human characters on Urth.  I presume
> you'll balk at the idea that he's the superior moral agent on all of Urth,
> but I'll look forward to your explanation why this isn't the case given the
> morality you advocate.
>
> Paul
>
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