<div dir="ltr">Frederick - if Moses didn't have free will, he wouldn't have smote the rock a second time...</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Oct 10, 2014 at 6:27 AM, Norwood, Frederick Hudson <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:NORWOODR@mail.etsu.edu" target="_blank">NORWOODR@mail.etsu.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Of course God has free will. But not Moses, as far as I can tell.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I’m of course talking ideal religious philosophy. Most of the people I know couldn’t give a good god damn what the Bible says. They think the Bible is inerrant,
which means that what conservative talk radio says the Bible says is inerrant, and never mind the words in the Book. On Conservapedia they have a version of a Bible with all the Liberal Lies removed. (For example, Jesus didn’t forgive the Second Thief, because
He wasn’t Soft On Crime.)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Rick Norwood<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Urth [mailto:<a href="mailto:urth-bounces@lists.urth.net" target="_blank">urth-bounces@lists.urth.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>António Pedro Marques<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 10, 2014 9:22 AM<span class=""><br>
<b>To:</b> The Urth Mailing List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: (urth) resurrecting a 2002 thread that posits an alternative lineage for Sev<u></u><u></u></span></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">The Bible is big enough to have a bit of everything in it. Catholics consider that faith is what sustains the Bible, rather than the reverse, so they're happy to read everything in it in light of Matthew 22:40. (That's an important difference
from other religions on the approach to Scripture. Yes, it isn't always lived up to, but you can end any argument with it.)<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">(Being a Catholic is very different from being a Protestant when it comes to the 'ethos'. Gerry's account of what it means to be Catholic in Ireland is in line with what I know of being Catholic everywhere else. NB that Gerry, last time
I heard, was not a believer in God or Church.)<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">In Exodus there is the part where God tells Moses He will abandon His people, because otherwise He'll become so angry at their behaviour that He'll smite them all. Moses reasons with Him not to do that. I find that throws an interesting
light on the issue of free will. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">And I actually think free will is central to an understanding of God and Catholic doctrine. In that regard, have you read St Augustine's book on the issue?<u></u><u></u></p>
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No dia 10/10/2014, às 13:06, "Norwood, Frederick Hudson" <<a href="mailto:NORWOODR@mail.etsu.edu" target="_blank">NORWOODR@mail.etsu.edu</a>> escreveu:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">I’m aware that many people believe this. In fact, I believe it up to a point. (Our free will is very limited, maybe limited only to the power to say No to
temptation.) What I said was there is nothing in the Bible to suggest that. (Desert peoples tend to believe in Kismet, not free will.)</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Rick Norwood</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Urth [<a href="mailto:urth-bounces@lists.urth.net" target="_blank">mailto:urth-bounces@lists.urth.net</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Dan'l Danehy-Oakes<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 09, 2014 12:38 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> The Urth Mailing List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: (urth) resurrecting a 2002 thread that posits an alternative lineage for Sev</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Frederick, no. God did not "decide" who would be damned/saved; He *knew* who would be damned/saved. There is a key difference. He creates beings with free will, but because of omniscience and His position outside of Time, he knows in advance
what they will do and how He will respond to those actions.<u></u><u></u></p>
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