<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:10pt"><div><br><span></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.3333px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal;"><span>Well, he knows the words, or seems to, though AFAICT none of these usages is Severian's, though ultimately all cases are the translator's usage. One is Jonas's.<br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.3333px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal;"><br><span></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.3333px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; background-color: transparent; font-style:
normal;"><span>But let's take them at face value. To Severian those words must be as archaic and obscure as, say, "haruspex" is to us, or perhaps only "godking" or "imperator." There are no kings or queens in Urth and may have not been for chiliads, because of Typhon, the autarchy, and Erebus/Abaia/Ascia. I interpret their use to suggest political unreality (and in a sense generic neutrality, as opposed to, say, "Chairman") vs. political reality---same as in our fairy tales but more so. Similarly, "prince" is the son of a king, not the lord of an </span><span>ancient principality.</span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.3333px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal;"><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 13.3333px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif;
background-color: transparent; font-style: normal;"><span>The upshot is that I don't expect the card above "patroness" to be "king." In the tarot, as Gwern points out, there are four face cards; in the regular deck only three. Either it is elector/patroness/autarch or it is something like page?/uhlan?/patroness/elector. And given the Byzantine and Holy Roman touches, I'd go with the latter (Tarot). <br class=""></span></div><div style="display: block;" class="yahoo_quoted"> <br> <br> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> On Wednesday, December 18, 2013 11:20 AM, Gwern Branwen <gwern@gwern.net> wrote:<br> </font> </div> <blockquote style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px;
margin-top: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> <div class="y_msg_container">On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 11:16 AM, Jerry Friedman<br clear="none"><<a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:jerry_friedman@yahoo.com" href="mailto:jerry_friedman@yahoo.com">jerry_friedman@yahoo.com</a>> wrote:<br clear="none">> Does<br clear="none">> Severian know anything about kings and queens?<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Yes. Grepping my 5 ebooks of _New Sun_, there are the following hits:<br clear="none"><br clear="none"> There was a sudden intensity in his quavering voice. "Severian,<br clear="none">the king was elected at the Marchfield.<br clear="none"> Counts were appointed by the kings. That was what they called the<br clear="none">dark ages. A baron was only a<br clear="none"> approach of battles, earthquakes, and the murders of kings.<br clear="none"> stoppered flask, and by breaking the seal and drawing forth the<br
clear="none">cork became queen from ice to ice. Just<br clear="none"> muttered, "Yes, it is a very old story, and the hero had told the<br clear="none">king, his father, that if he failed he would<br clear="none"> a lovely woman named Early Summer. She was the queen of that<br clear="none"> land, but her king was a strong, unforgiving man, and because she<br clear="none"> plant entered her and she conceived. She told the king, however,<br clear="none"> prophecies pleased the king much.<br clear="none"> in demeanor and obedient to the king (whom he believed to be his<br clear="none"> the king's enemies were drilled until they seemed men of bronze<br clear="none"> to Urth, and there he came to know of two brothers who were kings.<br clear="none"> never breed sons who would claim their grandfather's kingdom,<br clear="none">
their growth in her womb from the king, her uncle, they could not<br clear="none"> forth the wolves and called them the people of his kingdom, and<br clear="none"> and many men they went to the king and demanded their heritage.<br clear="none"> acknowledged queen of all the chickens for leagues around. How<br clear="none"> flew wild in the wind; Jolenta a floriate queen in armor spikey with<br clear="none"> Barbatus added, "You've commanded armies, Severian. You're a king and a<br clear="none"> the queen or guardian of your Urth, dismiss the thought. I am not. But yes,<br clear="none"> "You think me a queen, or something of the sort. Will it amaze you<br clear="none">to discover<br clear="none"> Great Erebus, who has established his kingdom there, will soon be driven<br clear="none"> Abaia's, whose kingdom is in the warm waters. With
others, less in might but<br clear="none"> a thing more marvelous on Yesod. The young king, bright with such gold as is<br clear="none"><br clear="none">-- <br clear="none">gwern<br clear="none"><a shape="rect" href="http://www.gwern.net/" target="_blank">http://www.gwern.net</a><div class="yqt8550561634" id="yqtfd46983"><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Urth Mailing List<br clear="none">To post, write <a shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:urth@urth.net" href="mailto:urth@urth.net">urth@urth.net</a><br clear="none">Subscription/information: <a shape="rect" href="http://www.urth.net/" target="_blank">http://www.urth.net</a><br clear="none"></div><br><br></div> </blockquote> </div> </div> </div> </div></body></html>