<div>'Those of us who stand by the whole canon should be ready to defend it with more than just saying the people who wrote it were savages.'<br></div><br>I tried to take a tentative stab at that in my earlier comments.<br>
<br> 'no amount of descriptions of יהוה as merciful can make up for actions by him which seem to contradict it. Other things may, but not simple adjectives. '<br><br>I believe I said God's mercy in the OT was emphasised continually by both ascription <i>and</i> actions. And, frankly, the ascriptions DO matter very much in the way the Bible works, I think. But yes, they are always accompanied by their embodiment in divine action. I would begin by pointing to the mercifully active CONTEXT that surrounds the Canaanite massacre and so on. That is, the grace of CREATION itself (and again I emphasise that the opening chapters of Genesis portray a mighty AND amazingly near, gracious, gentle, patient Creator - and just the sheer joy and goodness in the very creation itself reflecting God's worthiness to be praised and trusted. But also the divine compassion toward and rescue of the Israelites (which I already pointed to). Furthermore, there is the plan for redemption of all humanity that unfolds from the earliest moments and then right through. These strike me as FAR more fundamental to a good reading of the Bible's own doctrine of God than incidences of 'genocide' and so on (which I certainly never said needed to be glossed over - indeed, I tried briefly to take a direct look at them and reason from my premises of God's goodness as to how to understand them in that framework).<div>
<br></div><div>Good thoughts, Antonio.<br><div><br></div><div>-DOJP<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">2012/3/11 António Pedro Marques <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:entonio@gmail.com">entonio@gmail.com</a>></span><br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Daniel Petersen wrote (08-03-2012 20:07):<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Hey, I thought you didn't want to discuss this! :)<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Yep. Now I should be writing a lengthy reply, because the issues you raised deserve it, but I have no time so I'll just have to be succint and not enter into them.<br>
<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
The *larger* summary of the doctrine of God from the entire OT could not<br>
possibly be accurately represented by a summary of the (alleged) doctrine of<br>
God one garners merely from the orders to exterminate the Canaanites (...)<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Notice I said:<br>
<br>
'The key word is *summary*. Otherwise there's just no way to go around all the clear, insistent and absolute *orders* to fully exterminate the Canaanites.'<br>
<br>
I meant two things here:<br>
<br>
1. It's unsophisticated because/if it's a *summary*.<br>
2. The violence in the first books of the OT just can't be glossed over. Those of us who stand by the whole canon should be ready to defend it with more than just saying the people who wrote it were savages.<br>
<br>
A point I didn't make, but I think one of you Danielses invited it: no amount of descriptions of יהוה as merciful can make up for actions by him which seem to contradict it. Other things may, but not simple adjectives. Adjectives are cheap. Istr a passage (in Exodus?) where, a little after some egregiously violent bit (or a recollection of one), יהוה refers to himself as slow to anger and quick to forgive. That just won't do in its face. In my opinion it doesn't work for the Qur'an, so it doesn't work for the Bible either. We must be able to defend God better than that. I think we can. I don't think we work hard enough.<br>
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