If that horse is a wolf, then I think the case is closed! :)<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 12:48 PM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:brunians@brunians.org">brunians@brunians.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">Severian is a member of the mystical Body of Christ.<br>
<br>
>From the horse's mouth.<br>
<br>
.<br>
<div><div></div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
> That's is an awfully thin reed for "Severian is supposed to literally<br>
> be Jesus" rather than "Severian is supposed to parrallel Jesus in<br>
> important ways". Perhaps the distinction is irrelevant for a<br>
> non-believer, but the author is not a non-believer.<br>
><br>
> On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 2:54 PM, Jordon Flato <<a href="mailto:jordonflato@gmail.com">jordonflato@gmail.com</a>><br>
> wrote:<br>
>> And Wolfe is on record as saying that the only thing we're ever told<br>
>> that<br>
>> Jesus the Carpenter's son made was a Whip.<br>
>><br>
>> Witz and I have always been in agreeance on this, and because of that,<br>
>> I'm<br>
>> more likely to find textual support for the idea than for the idea of<br>
>> him as<br>
>> some sort of anti-christ.<br>
>><br>
>> On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 10:20 AM, <a href="mailto:Sonofwitz@butcherbaker.org">Sonofwitz@butcherbaker.org</a><br>
>> <<a href="mailto:Sonofwitz@butcherbaker.org">Sonofwitz@butcherbaker.org</a>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> On Jun 24, 2010, at 5:05 AM, David Stockhoff <<a href="mailto:dstockhoff@verizon.net">dstockhoff@verizon.net</a>><br>
>>> wrote:<br>
>>><br>
>>> > There's a bit in John that says (I paraphrase): Jesus does not come<br>
>>> to<br>
>>> > put the world on trial or to condemn it, but to rescue it.<br>
>>> ><br>
>>> > Severian comes to carry out a death sentence.<br>
>>><br>
>>><br>
>>> I definitely feel that "the Sev is not divine" arguments are fine and<br>
>>> appropriate, and I don't care to try to convince anyone, but I think<br>
>>> it's a<br>
>>> shame that people get hung up on this idea that Severian did a bad<br>
>>> thing,<br>
>>> that he "carried out a death sentance".<br>
>>> This view is not, er, holistic to the themes. The most boiled down<br>
>>> theme<br>
>>> in this book, holographically repeated, is Death and Resurrection. We<br>
>>> must<br>
>>> not forget that.<br>
>>><br>
>>> Severian brought renewed life to the planet. the death of Urth was the<br>
>>> birth of Ushas, and the resurection of the dying planet. To miss this<br>
>>> is to<br>
>>> fundamentally misunderstand the books, I think. To view this as a<br>
>>> death<br>
>>> sentence, one is basically taking the short sighted selfish side that<br>
>>> Severian's foes had. They would deny the future for a few more years<br>
>>> for<br>
>>> themselves.<br>
>>> Fuck that. This is a cycle that we see in nature. The forest has to<br>
>>> burn<br>
>>> for it's own good, periodically.<br>
>>><br>
>>> I'm sorry, just about any reading goes, but to just see Severian's act<br>
>>> as<br>
>>> a just tradgedy seems to completely miss the point.<br>
>>><br>
>>> It had to be a torturer to deliver the death stroke that brought new<br>
>>> life.<br>
>>> No one else would obey. Everyone else prefers to save themselves and<br>
>>> cling<br>
>>> to their attachments like children. Severian did a difficult,<br>
>>> necessary,<br>
>>> and beautiful thing.<br>
>>><br>
>>> ~witz<br>
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>><br>
>><br>
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><br>
<br>
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br>