Yeah Mike, this was great. I really think this nails it, and encapsulates the holographic majesty of Wolfe's work here. Adam, I think there was a claw in the stone, and I think it's the same claw that Severian finds on the rosebush near the end of citidel, and winds up taking back with him to the past, in UotNS, so it is yet another closed loop.<br>
<br>If there is *any* power to the thorn at all, it comes directly from sev. His blood does get on it, so perhaps a portion of the power he gains from the white fountain is passed on to it, but I'm more inclined to think it has no real power in itself, other than to serve as a focus for Severian and his manefistations.<br>
<br>But as a symbol, it is priceless, and what Wolfe does with it is magnificent. I think Witz clearly draws out where it stands in the narrative.<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 2:38 PM, Son of Witz <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:sonofwitz@butcherbaker.org">sonofwitz@butcherbaker.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div class="im">On Tue, June 22, 2010 4:06 pm, Adam Thornton (IO) wrote:<br>
><br>
> Here's my theory. There's probably a better reason it's wrong than my Oz<br>
> theory.<br>
><br>
> The "claw" is just a flaw at the heart of the jewel. The thorn Severian<br>
> finds on the shore is just a thorn. The thorns on the rosebush near the<br>
> end of _Citadel_ are just thorns. It is Severian that makes them holy.<br>
> On<br>
> their own, they are just things.<br>
><br>
> Adam<br>
<br>
</div>If you're saying that the thorn he found was not in in the corundum, I<br>
don't agree. The text is pretty clear that the thorn was in the crystal,<br>
and even more so, if it's "just a thorn" why is it shining?.<br>
<br>
from the end of Sword:<br>
"I cannot say how it is possible for an object in itself black to give<br>
light, but this did. It might have been carved in jet, sodark it was and<br>
so highly polished; yet it shone, a claw as long as the last joint of my<br>
smallest finger, cruelly hooked and needle-pointed, the reality of that<br>
dark core at the heart of the gem, which must have been no more than a<br>
container for it, a lipsanotheca or pyx."<br>
<br>
I agree that Severian is what has made these things special. That he has<br>
this (ug, whatever you want to call it) Christ-Like semi-deity role as the<br>
Conciliator has imbued this thorn with some resonance of him is pretty<br>
clear. I the theological intent of Wolfe comes through pretty clearly to<br>
me. Severian has just defeated various symbolic "Foes of God" and broken<br>
all false allegiances to worldly institutions, and is now obedient to the<br>
role God has for him. This moment is a real clarification of this. Most<br>
of what happens in Sword is the defeat of these Foes of God. He "ascends"<br>
into the mountains, a vertical metaphor of transcendence, where he defeats<br>
the Zooanthropes (men who've surrendered God's gift of consciousness), he<br>
defeats the Circle of Sorcerers (men who would work to obstruct the coming<br>
of the New Sun), he defeats Typhon, (a man who would be a false god of a<br>
corrupt kingdom), and The Man of Science who would storm the gates of<br>
heaven. At this point, he really only has to go against the Ascians<br>
(Godless / Soulless Men) in this unwitting quest against the Foes of God.<br>
When he gives the claw back to the Pelerines and brings Master Ash back,<br>
he has literally saved the future from the ice, already.<br>
<br>
I just think it's really clear that at this point, when he has proven<br>
himself against all these traps and foes in his path, he has truly taken<br>
on his task, or taken up his cross. He's cleared the field and his shell<br>
has been broken away.<br>
<br>
Yes, he is what makes the claw a shiny, special thing. But this thorn,<br>
which, in the age of Ymar was not encased in crystal, has, over the<br>
thousands of years where Severian was not alive, become quite literally a<br>
crystalized Myth. That myth, carried young Severian to this point, and now<br>
he does not really need the myth, he is the essence of it, not that he<br>
knows it.<br>
<div><div></div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
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