Took the words right out of my mouth, you did. <br><br>I did go back and read over the previous 60+ posts of "Ushas", about the only thing mentioned as evidence was Tzadkiel's statement that the agonies of Urth will be "offered to the Increate". (Doesn't that sound sorta barbaric, incidentally?) And here I was all set to ask whether the Hierogrammates even mentioned the Increate, heh. At least they also seem to believe he exists.<br>
<br>However, there's a leap between this and saying they're privy to his Plan, hey?<br><br>Paul<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 2:54 PM, Dan'l Danehy-Oakes <<a href="mailto:danldo@gmail.com">danldo@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"><div class="Ih2E3d">On Fri, Jul 11, 2008 at 11:34 AM, Jeff Wilson <<a href="mailto:jwilson@io.com">jwilson@io.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> That was pretty much the discussion in progress just before you arrived. I'm<br>
> not convinced that God has no part in a plan involving the White Fountain;<br>
> as the omnipotent, omniscient creator of the universe, He is responsible for<br>
> its content and as such He kills everyone and destroys everything that<br>
> passeth away. How he implements His will and whether the intermediaries are<br>
> servants, sock puppets, or dupes is what we are sorting out.<br>
<br>
</div>Well, there's a further point here: one can claim that *any* action, by<br>
*anyone*, is part of God's Plan. To do this is to create moral anarchy<br>
for humans -- "Yes, I killed six million Jews, but that was part of God's<br>
plan, so it's okay." No, I don't think so; the only way to theodicize this is<br>
by assuming an extreme Calvinist-predestinarian stance.<br>
<br>
The only way to say that the Hiero*s don't share the same moral<br>
burden as humans is to say that they have direct knowledge of<br>
God's will. This is the justification for the Israelites' slaughter of the<br>
natives of Canaan -- "God said so," which trumped "Thou shalt<br>
not murder."<br>
<br>
So to justify the Hiero*s' actions, to say that their plan that involved<br>
the slaughter of Urth's billions, was morally OK, means that you have<br>
to present evidence that they have a direct knowledge of the will<br>
of the Increate, which I do not see in the text.<br>
<br>
--<br>
Dan'l Danehy-Oakes, writer, trainer, bon vivant<br>
-----<br>
<a href="http://www.livejournal.com/users/sturgeonslawyer" target="_blank">http://www.livejournal.com/users/sturgeonslawyer</a><br>
<a href="http://www.danehyoakes.com" target="_blank">http://www.danehyoakes.com</a><br>
<br>
I once absend-mindedly ordered Three Mile Island dressing in a<br>
restaurant and, with great presence of mind, they brought Thousand<br>
Island Dressing and a bottle of chili sauce. -- T. Pratchett<br>
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