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At 06:38 AM 8/9/2006, you wrote:<br><br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">James B. Jordan writes regarding
the fallen angel origin of the Nephilim:<br><br>
>Nephilim simply means "powerful men" "great
rulers,"<br><br>
but isn't the word also derived from the Hebrew for
"fallen"?</font></blockquote><br>
<x-tab> </x-tab>Or, those
who fall upon others.<br>
<x-tab> </x-tab>But, for
the rest, my point was that all of these things have multiple
understandings. I don't want to be taken as "pulling rank" or
anything, but as it happens I am the author of two books on the early
parts of Genesis, so I'm aware of lots of views, very common views. I
shared mine, but this is not the place to argue for my views. My point
was that it's hard to know which of the various understandings of these
texts are the ones Wolfe tends toward, and even if we did know, that
would not tell us whether he might be employing a reading that he regards
as erroneous for literary purposes. To wit, he may share the (most
common) view that the sons of God are Sethites, but choose to employ the
(minority) view that they are angels.<br>
<x-tab> </x-tab>I intended
only a cautionary note. @>----<br><br>
Pat. Nutria<br><br>
<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite=""><font size=3>also he
writes:<br><br>
>True, "son of God" means "ruler" in the Hebrew,
and is used for angels once <br>
>or twice, but it also >means "believer" and that is what
it means here.<br><br>
The beginning of Genesis 6 says:<br>
6:1 And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the
<br>
earth, and daughters were born unto them,<br>
6:2 That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair;
and <br>
they took them wives of all which they chose.<br><br>
This indicates to me that the "sons of God" were not men and
their <br>
intercourse with human women was something different from the human <br>
reproduction which had already covered the face of the earth. Why would
God <br>
need to cleanse the earth of "believers" with a flood, which is
described <br>
immediately after?<br><br>
and James says:<br><br>
>The sons of God who married the daughters of men because they were
"good" <br>
>(same word used >of the fruit Eve plucked) were the Sethites who
married <br>
>with the daughters of the Cainites. This >is clear from the
context. In <br>
>Genesis 4-5, men of the Sethite line worshipped Yahweh<br><br>
So, the forbidden fruit Eve plucked was good? And "The
serpent's job was to <br>
train them in wisdom". And what were these Sethite line guys doing
when the <br>
rest of humanity was mulitplying. Why did they only discover the
daughters <br>
of men later? I have trouble understanding all this, especially with a
more <br>
clear, alternate explanation available.<br><br>
and lastly James B. Jordan writes:<br><br>
>Without interviewing him, there is really no way to know what Wolfe
might <br>
>be thinking about >such things, hence no way to know what his
allusions <br>
>might be. Moreover, Wolfe may be alluding >to fantastical readings
of <br>
>Genesis (e.g., Lilith) that he himself does not believe. So, be
careful, <br>
>and don't over-read.<br><br>
Yes, but aren't you the James Jordan who did interview Wolfe and to whom
he <br>
explicitly stated his belief in the reality of pagan gods?
Regarding <br>
Lilith, yes, James Jordan and Roy Lackey had a discussion of Wolfe's use
of <br>
this myth in regard to Copperhead about five years ago. Why would his use
of <br>
Lilith in BotNS be surprising? And at the risk of sounding disrespectful
and <br>
irreverent I must ask if the admonition to be careful and not over-read
also <br>
applies to Bible reading ;-)?<br><br>
-bsharp<br><br>
<br>
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8/7/2006</blockquote>
<x-sigsep><p></x-sigsep>
James B. Jordan<br>
Director, Biblical Horizons<br>
Box 1096<br>
Niceville, FL 32588<br>
<a href="http://www.biblicalhorizons.com/" eudora="autourl">
http://www.biblicalhorizons.com</a></font></body>
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