(urth) Lupiverse(es)

[James Wynn]

Look, the justification for Ushas is simple:
Humanity's descendants cruelly (tortuously) transformed animals into the 
Heiros. And now the Heiros are returning the favor to ensure humanity 
--in every universe possible-- will progress to a form in which they 
will torture the Hieros  into existence.

Yes, there's a theological aspect to this. In Romans, Paul cites God's 
sovereignty over the destiny of individuals and nations. That he has 
knows...has even chosen since the creation of the world who would be 
saved and who would be damned. He cites the verse from the O.T. saying 
"Jacob have I loved and Esau have I hated." His imaginary audience 
responds "Then how does God judge us since no one has resisted his 
Will?" Paul answers "Who are you to judge God? Doesn't the maker have 
the power and right to make of his creation whatever he wants? Some for 
honor and some for destruction."

This is God as torturer. And it is a similar justification offered in 
Job ("I'm God. I have a plan. I'm not inclined to explain how I arrived 
at it and, more importantly, and I'm not obliged to." People who ask for 
a "Christian" justification of God's command to the Israelites to 
completely drive out the Canaanites, have misunderstood the God of the 
Bible.

But all this doesn't precisely map to the Heiros and it's not supposed 
to. In that case, this issue is this: "Was it wrong for the Heiros to 
destroy humanity to create Ushas?"
"[Shrug] The Hieros are humanity's creation. Who is has done the wrong 
here? "

This is a scenario that intentionally subverts the idea of personal 
guilt. And, no, there is nothing Christian or even Catholic about that. 
There is a theme here, but there is no "moral".

J.

On 3/14/2012 2:03 PM, Lee Berman wrote:
> Craig Brewer:
>> 1) The sun was dying out (whether "naturally" or because of the Hieros),
>> so humanity was up a creek, anyway. From a broad perspective, the flood's
>> "genocide" also kept humanity on Urth/Ushas going, creating (if not exactly
>> saving) more lives.
>
> I disagree. In the Master Ash episode, he makes it clear to Severian that
> almost the entire population was rescued from the freezing Urth. Making it
> clear to the reader that renewing the planet was not for the purpose of
> saving or preserving humanity per se. Wolfe would not have put this section
> in unless he was trying to say it was more than a racial survival issue.
>
> Either millions of people died in the Flood on Urth over a simple nostalgia
> for renewing the physical planet of origin or there is something more deeply
> spiritual going on. (though nostalgia is a form of spirituality I'd say).
>
>> 2) Renewing the sun isn't a spiritual salvation like Christ's sacrifice.
>
> Agreed. But renewing the sun is like Noah's Flood which I think Wolfe is trying
> to say WAS a form of spiritual salvation of humanity. I'm not sure how most
> Christian theologians feel about Noah's Flood but this view makes sense if you
> don't want to believe in a God who is capriciously genocidal and/or uncaring
> about His creations. To justify the Flood, one must believe in a huge spiritual
> benefit to balance the painful deaths of so many millions of people and animals.
>
>   Urth continues, and it's a better place, but it's not a perfect "Christian" world,
> right? There's still something like idol worship of Severian, etc. But at least it's
> closer, right?  So it's like steps toward salvation where the central "true" story
> gradually becomes more and better understood/told/remembered/lived.
>
>
>> 3) ...Obviously, life just keeps going on Ushas, although in a different (and hopefully
>> better) form. ...I'm not saying you can't still draw "spiritual" conclusions about all of
>> this. But they're going to be more indirect, I think, than "this is Wolfe's final theological>statement on X." For example: Urth continues, and it's a better place, but it's not a perfect>"Christian" world, right? There's still something like idol worship>of Severian, etc. But at
>> least it's closer, right? ..
>
> Yes. 100% agreed. 		 	   		
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