(urth) Typhon's nature

[David Stockhoff]

On 10/12/2011 11:09 AM, Gerry Quinn wrote:
> *From:* David Stockhoff <mailto:dstockhoff at verizon.net>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 12, 2011 3:35 PM
> *To:* The Urth Mailing List <mailto:urth at lists.urth.net>
> *Subject:* [BGSpam]Re: (urth) Typhon's nature
>
> > On 10/12/2011 9:03 AM, Gerry Quinn wrote:
>
> > > But if we look at the Ascians, the coin, Typhon etc., what I think we
> > > see is a deliberate blurring of the boundaries between powers of
> > > charisma, force of personality etc., and powers which we would
> > > consider telepathic. Mucor’s telepathic abilities, apparently the
> > > result of brain modification, suggest to me that in Wolfe’s world 
> some
> > > elements of telepathy exist in everyone, but are stronger in some, 
> and
> > > probably trainable (c.f. Decuman and the village of sorcerers). 
> Typhon
> > > probably does have some telepathic powers which enhance his already
> > > great powers of charisma etc. It is a not uncommon trope in 
> sf/fantasy.
> > > Severian (and other narrators) are not delusional about the existence
> > > of such powers, but the powers are not of any special significance to
> > > the story.
>
> > Downplaying mental magic seems pointless if such magic serves the
> > narrative, which it obviously does. There's no question that telepathy
> > is a classic pulp trope that simply must appear in TBotNS, and 
> therefore
> > it appears. Typhon's powers, great or little, came up in a 
> discussion of
> > cloning and Silk---THAT is their critical significance. (Note: Mucor’s
> > telepathic abilities are NOT the result of brain modification but of
> > genetic modification, since they are present in embryo and such embryos
> > are very special.) But there is more.
> I don’t mean it is downplayed as such, I just think it is not an 
> element of special significance.
> As for Mucor, I agree that the engineering is probably genetic, 
> although there are other possibilities. What I meant was that the 
> intended and actual result of the embryological tinkering was to cause 
> her brain to develop in an unusual fashion, which somehow endowed her 
> with phenomenal psyschic powers.
Exactly. I just wanted to be clear there, since the brain develops AFTER 
the genes are set.
>
> > I see Typhon's role in TBotNS as a sort of hyper-anti-Autarch, a Satan
> > to Severian's parallel/opposite Christ figure, who demands that 
> Severian
> > kneel and accept him as his lord.
> I agree, though his role seems more nuanced in the later series. 
> Speaking of psychic powers, it seems possible that in BotNS it is 
> something that is associated with evil, devil worship, the dark side 
> who oppose Severian (though perhaps are not all wholly averse to the 
> coming of Ushas). The ‘good’ characters do not seem to have such 
> powers, at least not in fashions similar to Typhon, Decuman, Abaia 
> etc. Perhaps it is the old trope of misusing such powers for personal 
> gain.
Quite possible! Pact with the devil and all that. Manfred, perhaps. See 
below.
> > Sev is practically just out of the
> > womb of the Tower and has left the guild for good when he meets Typhon
> > and is at a very low point. So what's the first thing Typhon does? He
> > feeds Severian and demands an oath of loyalty.
>
> > What is wrong with this oath? The more unique Typhon is, the more that
> > oath would be to his person and less to his throne. Typhon is all
> > arrogance and denial of love and death. His military prowess is implied
> > at best, but hints are dropped, in the context of the very SF tradition
> > you call "not uncommon," as to his unique mental powers. What good does
> > it do to drop fake hints? They can mislead or provoke thought or 
> lead to
> > other points, but they should not confuse.
> For me they are not confusing because I do not find it very important 
> what exact mix of technological, personality, and psychic powers is 
> possessed by Typhon. Whether he has sent his thoughts into far places 
> by telepathy or by logging onto still extant computer databases is 
> something we are simply not told, and Severian, if he knew, would 
> probably find both possibilities equally astounding.
> - Gerry Quinn
Astounding, or else pedestrian. We can't really tell, can we? But I 
agree that mechanisms are not strictly critical outside of hard SF, 
which this ain't. But what about my point above? An interstellar emperor 
who basically uses Daddy's wealth to create his empire is quite 
different from one who asserts the power of his self, is it not? (A 
Trump-style president who uses self-promotion to hide his incompetence 
vs an Eisenhower?) Force of personality, force of mind, same thing. 
Fancy electronics---not so much. BIG difference there, and that's a 
bigger point than ESP, aside from the cloning debate.

Typhon wants to govern the universe by unleashing (ungoverning) himself. 
That's why I call him anti-Autarch. If his powers come from himself, the 
point is more strongly made.


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