(urth) Babbiehorn?: Was: a sincere question mostly for roy

[David Stockhoff]

On 11/17/2011 9:43 AM, James Wynn wrote:
>
>>> James Wynn wrote:
>>> No. I don't agree with Marc's explanation that Horn's spirit fled 
>>> wholesale into Babbie. I think it is certain that Babbie has some 
>>> Silk in him at the time we see him wearing glasses. He surely has 
>>> some Horn in him much of the time. He's a psychic creature. It might 
>>> be that the confabulation of identities between the Rajan-Narrator 
>>> and Babbie would not be possible if the Rajan were not a Neighbor. 
>>> It is very reasonable that Horn's identity has been absorbed into 
>>> Babbie the way Rose's was absorbed by her prosthetic hands. It might 
>>> not have been possible though if it were not for the time that 
>>> Neighbor-Horn and Babbie spent together. After Horn died on Green, 
>>> Babbie might represent the most genuine presence of Horn in the 
>>> whole rest of the story.
>>>
>>> Honestly, I think Horn's soul left when he died in the pit. His body 
>>> and mind were lost on Green. All that is left of Horn (except what 
>>> is in Babbie) is his mission that the Rajan is devoted to completing 
>>> and what the Rajan remembers from his memories. And as I have said: 
>>> If the Neighbors have perfect memories, that is enough.
>>
>> David Stockhoff wrote:
>> The problem there, I'm sure you will agree, then is what to do with 
>> the end of OBW. There must be enough left of Horn's mind in the Rajan 
>> to die. 
>
> Horn died in the pit. That is when his spirit abandoned his body and 
> went the Outsider. That is why the Rajan, at the end of RttW says that 
> he "killed" Hoof & Hide's father. The Rajan was that greenbuck Horn 
> was chasing when he fell into the pit. The Neighbors that have 
> survived have developed a high sensitivity to preying on others. That 
> is how they survived. No sentient inhumi will prey on them because 
> their children would starve.

Ah. I remember the greenbuck theory and I agree with the Neighbor as 
Rajan---that all makes sense. But I didn't think about exactly how the 
Neighbors have morally evolved. So that explains why they will kill 
inhumi, as they told ... Horn? ... but they don't war with them when 
they could. I gather they don't mind when humans eat them either?
>
> I think that Horn's "good-bye" at the end of OBW needs to be 
> interpreted with the understanding that *we don't know* Silk is in 
> there at that time. Nothing in the narration lets on that the narrator 
> has exchanged Horn's body with Silk's. That is the big 
> reveal/cliff-hanger at the end of OBW when he says "I took the ball, I 
> won the game." It's supposed to be a WTH moment. So when the narrator 
> only says good-bye to Horn's family there, he is just maintaining 
> character. But he doesn't die. The tree, the inhumi, the fear that he 
> will be killed...we're still laying the foundation there.

It's clear to me that Silk is there already, but that's only because I 
know. So, yes, if it is to be understood on first read, Horn has to be 
visibly "killed" again. That works because it has a clear effect on the 
primary narrative level---perhaps then exactly "how" he died/retired 
doesn't need to be pinned down.

I'd still like to know if you think Horn can fade into the background 
without dying. That's my literal sense of it---he just gives up.