(urth) Severa

[Gerry Quinn]

From: Lee Berman 

> > > Then there is Agia. There are a couple converging lines of evidence that
> > >  she is Severian's cousin.

> > Gerry Quinn: What evidence?
 
> It wouldn't be evidence for you, Gerry. You have spent 2 or 3 years here
> demonstrating that your definition of that word is "supports my own beliefs".
> Your demonstration of this skewed definition also includes taking what
> all other posters call evidence and relabeling it as "rubbish" or 
> "nonsense" or "ridiculous, mindless, unthoughtout, bizzare...etc. etc.". There is
> no point in responding to such a request from you. Your rejoinder regarding
> the ideas of others is completely predictable. The only variation in your posts
> is which derrogatory term for others you will use this time.

Why the fear of posting it, if all posters but I would consider it evidence?
 
 
> > However, I think you have inadvertently hit on something that indicates she was never 
> > a witch.

> > Heh! You made me laugh with that one, Gerry! Nothing inadvertent there. Sorry if that
> > takes some of the pats off your own back.  I was aware of Palaemon's explanation of the 
> > guild when I put the quote from the waitress in and the ambiguous nature of that clue in 
> > regard to her origin. As others here recognize, that statement might lend support and might 
> > also undercut the idea that she had been a witch.

Curious that you did not mention those implications.  But <shrug> they have been stated now anyway.


> >David stockhoff: Good eye. But a witch who recognizes a torturer outside the Citadel might not say 
> >so;

> We have some evidence regarding this- Upon their meeting, Merryn comments on "this man in fuligin".
> The Cumaean explains, "he is but a torturer". Is Merryn, a Citadel resident, really so ignorant?
> Perhaps.  Severian remembers running an errand for the Torturers. They apparently don't remember
> him. And he is dressed as an apprentice then, not in fuligin, but why does Merryn not know what
> fuligin means?

If she doesn’t (it’s not altogether clear – “this man in fuligin” can be taken in a number of ways) it’s an argument against Merryn being Severa (same applies to Jolenta)  While not all witches might have torturers uppermost on their mind, surely a witch named Severa – if that is truly an indication of being born a twin – would take an interest in their affairs.  Again, of course that presupposes that Merryn was originally called Severa, taking another name later as members of religious orders often do.  The books lack any Severa other than the young girl in the mountains.  
 

> Further ambiguous evidence: in the appendix on social classes, Jolenta is listed as part of the 
> "commonality" while Severian and other Citadel residents are listed as "servants of the throne".
> But it also says servants of the throne are drawn from the commonality. Thus, the waitress is
> part of the commonality due to her occupation, but there is a loophole which could allow her to
> have formerly been a servant of the throne.

That wouldn’t be a problem anyway, as presumably any non-exultant kicked out penniless into Nessus would become part of the commonality.   A worse problem, perhaps, is Wolfe’s selection of her as an exemplar of the commonality.


> > Any idea what her coloring was before Talos transformed her?

> She is a thin woman with straggling hair. The lack of information regarding her hair color is
> interesting, as Wolfe seems later to reveal it through the odd revelation of her pubic hair
> resembling a downy chick (i.e. golden).     

It seems cuffs and collar do not entirely match.  But some of that could be down to Dr. Talos’s silken threads.

- Gerry Quinn

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