(urth) UotNS and how it screws with your head

[David Stockhoff]

My father-in-law, who eschews SF because it lacks hope with a capital 
(C)H(RIST), would agree with you.

I disagree. As a Catholic acquaintance once said to me, "Catholicism is 
not supposed to be easy." If you take it seriously, it acknowledges the 
most horrifying pain of existence and tries to justify it. I respect that.

BotNS has a perpetual subtext of violence and injustice. You could trace 
every chapter and scene simply by the violence done or attempted by one 
human being to/on another. There is a purpose to this subtext.

Lee Berman wrote:
> John Watkins:
>
>   
>> I don't think so...I think the black hole in the Sun exists as a white fountain
>> in the lower universe (Abbadon?)   It would follow that the white fountain Severian
>> creates exists as a black hole in Yesod or some higher plane.  There may be an
>> incredible number oflayers of universes...
>>     
>
>  
> Nice post John. My thinking has leaned in the same direction, heavily influenced
> by the (surprisingly) hard SF, (shockingly) foresighted 1972 book, The Gods Themselves,
> by Asimov. I don't feel it is considered a very seminal work though it did win the Hugo
> and Nebula.  Surely Wolfe read it?
>  
> It paints a very similar picture of the universes leaking from higher energy to lower
> which might clarify things in BotNS. As you say, Severian's (and Apheta's?) creation
> was a White Fountain in Briah. But it was a black hole they created in Yesod
> (no snarky comments please). Was Yesod (or maybe Sol) left with a black hole that they
> will need to repair? 
>  
> We have heard the black hole in Urth's sun was created as a punishment. But could we 
> infer that it (also) was created when a nastier version of Severian travelled to Briah
> to get a white fountain to bring back and heal the black hole for a nastier version of
> Urth in Abbadon?
>  
>  
>   
>> Metaphorically (and maybe literally), I think Wolfe is making a point about
>> grace...God, being the well that never goes dry, can give without taking... et cetera.
>> These points would be lost, or their effectiveness reduced, if the white fountain and
>> the black hole were one and the same.
>>     
>  
> Wolfe is usually portrayed as a devout Catholic but, given his writing, I have serious
> doubts whether he has the same view of grace and the "God Is Love" stuff that most 
> Christians have or are supposed to have. He really seems to have a dark and pessimistic
> side which comes out in pretty much all his work. Where, in his work, is the shining,
> uncompromised  redemption we must (as christians) eventually, somehow achieve? Is he
> saving that for his last novel maybe?
>  
> In a way I hope so. But I doubt Gene Wolfe's worldview is likely to become more 
> positive as he nears death. Tzadkiel, who is so much more spiritually advanced than 
> Severian, is still infinitely far from the Increate. I suspect a soul will have to pass 
> through an eternity of incarnations before becoming one with God, in the Wolfean cosmos.
> And that is dark, pessimistic and depressing. 		 	   		  
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