(urth) Rudesind / Inire / Lunar Picture

[John Watkins]

On Tue, Jul 27, 2010 at 11:34 AM, Ryan Dunn <ryan at liftingfaces.com> wrote:

> No, the two Severians seems fairly obvious to me. In the Atrium of Time, he
> overlaps himself in two times, from what I gathered. Here is what Severian
> as Autarch asks of Rudesind...
>
>

Something weird happens in that scene.  Whatever it is, it could be a local
effect (it's the Atrium of Time) and it doesn't convince me that there are
two different Severians rather than one Severian whose personal timeline is
knotty.


>  "We only want to say that if a young man with an errand comes past again
> while you are on your ladder, you are to send him to Master Ultan. That is
> our order."
>
> It sort of means the story we've been told/sold is non-linear, and that the
> Severian at the end of Citadel exists before the Severian at the beginning
> of Shadow, no?
>
>

That seems like a gigantic leap.  Rudesind remembers sending a younger
Severian to Master Ultan.  Severian himself is asking that Rudesind do
it "again."  Other than the hierodules, who live backwards, who else is at
an earlier point in their personal timeline during the events at the end of
Citadel?


>  ...ryan
>
>
>  On Jul 27, 2010, at 11:11 AM, John Watkins wrote:
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 27, 2010 at 11:06 AM, Ryan Dunn <ryan at liftingfaces.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> . It would mean he is in collusion with Inire, and it also reenforces the
>> Severian prior being a wanderer of the corridor of time. Later in the story,
>> doesn't he tell Rudesind to give his future self directions to the library
>> if he comes by? If so, might that not be Rudesind relaying a message to a
>> younger Severian, who was Autarch?
>>
>>
> I like this, because it fits with what we know about Rudesind (he delivers
> messages for Inire).
>
> I'm not sure that we *know *Severian was sending a message to his younger
> self.  He really just says basically "Well, send other boys along the same
> route," which is consistent with him just telling Rudesind he did the right
> thing and to keep up the good work.
>
> But that ties into my broader skepticism about the "other" Severian.  We
> treat the "two Severian" theory as canon, when really it comes from
> Severian's own musings at the end of Citadel. I think some of the chief
> phenomena the theory was mean to explain (the tomb, Apu Punchau) are shown,
> to some extent, in Urth to be explainable by the time travel of a single
> Severian.
>
> But who knows.
>
>
>
>> ...ryan
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