(urth) The Outsider

[Son of Witz]

On Dec 16, 2010, at 12:09 PM, "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes" <danldo at gmail.com> wrote:

> Like Witz, I agree with ... well, _most_ of what you say. Here're my
> points of difference.
> 
> On Thu, Dec 16, 2010 at 11:29 AM, Andrew Mason
> <andrew.mason53 at googlemail.com> wrote:
> 
>> This could be explained in various ways:
>> that Jesus is actually present within that universe.
>> that there is an analogue of Jesus, who is merely a prophet.
>> that the stories have somehow been transmitted from another universe.
>> But I don't think the first is ruled out.
> 
> I do. The idea of multiple Incarnations is not only "not strictly
> Orthodox Christianity," it is abhorrent to the idea that Jesus died
> once _for all_. "All" is a big word, which I mostly try to avoid, but
> it's unambiguously present in Scripture.
> 

Wait.  That Jesus saved us once and for all is theological interpretation, more than scripture, right?  I think we can say that we are pretty sure the man Jesus actually lived and preached in our universe, but it is only theology and belief to say that his acts provided eternal salvation for the residents of that universe. I mean, where is the proof of that? The proof that he existed seems very real, but the rest is, sorry, speculation and unverified Revelation. It may be right, but that's not my point.

From there we can say that there are clearly historical traces of the man Jesus in the Chrasmalogical writings at the very least.  




 
>> It's the basis of the Narnia series, and Lewis is generally seen as
>> pretty orthodox.
> 
> Actually, a number of fundamentalists have condemned the Narnia books
> on precisely this ground. I think that's throwing the baby out with
> the bathwater; the Narnia books are good stories, and even have a lot
> to recommend them theologically. But the idea that Aslan's death in
> tLtW&tW is analogous to Christ's salvific death on Earth has to be
> taken with a whole salt lick.
> 
>> I don't see anything to make me say 'This is a
>> universe without Christ' - though at the time the events take place,
>> it's certainly a universe where Christ is not _known_.
> 
> That's actually another theological problem. Scripture has the Church
> enduring to the end of days.
> 
>> Now, it is certainly true that a link is drawn between the Outsider
>> and Dionysus. But I don't see that as negating the connection with the
>> Christian God, but as suggesting a connection between the Christian
>> God and Dionysus - a connection which others (Lewis and Soyinka, at
>> least) have drawn, and which, therefore, can't be ruled out.
> 
> Oddly enough I don't have a problem with this...
> 
> -- 
> Dan'l Danehy-Oakes
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