(urth) Ansible Interview

[Matthew Groves]

I was confusing the issues.  Point 1: In relation to the idea that the
shade might be pulses of dark along the axis of the long sun: This
would be insufficient to cast the shadow that is night in the Whorl.
The shadow would diffuse.  You need a whole shade.

Point 2:  It's always noon under the long sun. On the inner surface of
the whorl you can create a shadow, but only directly beneath the
opaque object, and hence shadows in the skylands would be invisible
from the ground, hiding beneath the object casting them.  You can see
shadows in your office because the objects casting them are close to
the surface they're casting on, and you are close enough to get your
line of sight at an angle to the direction of the light.  Silk could
see the shadow of his hand on the ground beneath him, buy no skyland
valleys full of shadow.

On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 5:54 PM, Son of Witz <sonofwitz at butcherbaker.org> wrote:
> I'm sitting under tubular flourescent bulbs (complete with shade unit) all day long, right now in fact.  I guarantee there are shadows.  they're sort of diffuse, but they are definitely shadows.
> ~witz
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Matthew Groves [mailto:matthewalangroves at gmail.com]
>>Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2009 02:55 PM
>>To: 'The Urth Mailing List'
>>Subject: Re: (urth) Ansible Interview
>>
>>Some people seem to have a very different idea of what the long sun
>>and its shade are than I do.  To my mind, the questioner is correct to
>>ask how there could be shadows in the skylands.  There couldn't.  And
>>why should the shade need to be translucent in order to see skylands?
>>Aren't folks just looking *past* the shade?  What good is a
>>translucent shade?  If we're talking about *diffuse* light casting
>>*shadows*, then I'm completely lost.  Go stand directly under a long,
>>tubular fluorescent bulb, or better, a column of them.  Try casting a
>>coherent shadow.  It's real tough, huh?  You're gonna need a whole
>>shade.
>>
>>On Wed, Jan 21, 2009 at 4:31 PM, Son of Witz <sonofwitz at butcherbaker.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> well.......
>>>
>>> the sun turns. It may be a cylinder or a plane, but the point is that half of it is shaded.
>>> meaning, it's photon vectors are not omnidirectional.
>>> At some points the sun is a sliver. it widens & narrows through the day.
>>> and there IS a shade, that's why sunset is called Shadelow, I don't remember pulses of darkness and I just finished that book.
>>> So as this light plane, or half cylinder rotates, it would have shadows.
>>>
>>> And then there is ambient reflected light, and we're talking about Shadows in the skylands, where, conceivably, there would only be reflected light off of neighboring lands that aren't yet in darkness. Then the fact that the Shade is not opaque, since you can see the skylands in the first place, so there would be additional reflected light.  I think all of that adds up to enough an uneven distribution of light, and thus shadows.
>>>
>>> /my two cents.
>>> ~witz
>>>
>>> >-----Original Message-----
>>> >From: David Stockhoff [mailto:dstockhoff at verizon.net]
>>> >Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2009 01:50 PM
>>> >To: urth at lists.urth.net
>>> >Subject: (urth) Ansible Interview
>>> >
>>> >I have been browsing the Ansible interview, and I notice what seems to
>>> >be a simple, incontrovertible error on Wolfe's part:
>>> >
>>> >8. /How is Silk able to see these valleys filled with shadows [in the
>>> >skylands at night, at the opening of chapter 4, book 1] if the Whorl is
>>> >a cylinder with the long sun running approximately down the centre?/ --
>>> >This one throws me completely. Where is the difficulty, unless all the
>>> >valleys run parallel to the Long Sun? Naturally they don't. [DRL: I see
>>> >a Wolfean trap here. The groundlings' references to the 'shade' of night
>>> >strongly suggest a literal revolving shade around the sun. But there are
>>> >later indications that night involves some sort of dark stuff sent in
>>> >pulses along the axis to mask a certain length of the Long Sun.]
>>> >
>>> >Thing is, the Whorl is the interior surface of a cylinder. Therefore,
>>> >"up" is always toward the center.
>>> >
>>> >Since the LS runs along the center from end to end, you can treat the
>>> >issue of shadows with only 2 dimensions. It won't matter whether the
>>> >valleys run along the Sun or the other way. Only if they are tilted or
>>> >overhanging will they cast shadows.
>>> >
>>> >Anyway, as Langford notes, there is a shade of some kind always blocking
>>> >one side of the Sun.
>>> >
>>> >So we should not assume Wolfe to be perfect in his physics. ;)
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >---
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